Sports and the importance of size debate

[QueensburyRules]

During , Carnera returned to . Though a Blackshirt during the war, he was exempted from actual because of his health—Carnera had one kidney removed in 1938, his kidney disease thought to be related to his . He did, however, serve as a reluctant tool for the *******s. He also continued to fight in exhibition bouts and made a few films in Italy to earn much-needed cash.
Encyclopaedia Brittanica.


In 1941, Carnera was hand-picked by Mussolini to take part in a propaganda film in North Africa. In order "to prove the inferiority of Negro race" a boxing match was set up between Carnera and a 6 foot 3 inch Zulu POW by the name of Kay Masaki.


This chapter analyses the propagandistic construction of the boxer Primo Carnera as a ******* hero during the 1930s. It draws on studies of propagandistic nation building and on the centrality of sport and sports films to political communication, especially in the cases of dictatorships. Applying social semiotic multimodality, the study textually and visually investigates documentaries and newsreels about Carnera found in the archive of Istituto Luce, the Italian film institute that under fascism spread Mussolini’s propaganda. The results show that any event of Carnera’s life served the ******* purpose, from fighting in London to training in the USA, from being surrounded by an adoring crowd in Italy to attending kids’ boxing matches in Miami. Textually, the grandiloquent language of the regime extolled Carnera’s international fame and devotion to ******* values; visually, the propaganda highlighted Carnera’s strength and Italianness. Importantly, when Carnera spoke directly to the camera, he replicated Mussolini’s verbal and non-verbal language. These items were shot before the racial laws, when the regime still hoped to enter the international forum of Western democracies. The internationally renowned boxer was thus meant as a sort of passport for fascism, able to improve the uneven relationships of the dictatorship with other nations.

Primo ("Old Satchelfoot") Carnera has been reported wounded in action. He has been reported shot for treason by the *******s. But last week the former world's heavyweight champion was reported gloriously alive, the victim of the most ignominious defeat in his ponderous career.

Allied troops who escaped from Italian prison camps told how Carnera had been selected as the hero of a ******* propaganda movie illustrating the physical superiority of Italians over African Negroes. For this purpose, the propagandists chose an impressive opponent for Carnera: a burly, six-foot-three Zulu prisoner from the Army of South Africa, Kay Masaki. He had never boxed before. He was fed nothing for three days, then placed in the ring with Carnera. The cameras started grinding.

With one blow, Camera sent Masaki crashing to the floor. The big Negro stayed there a while. Then he struggled to his feet, dazedly shook his head and, advancing on Carnera, delivered a fearful haymaker under the Italian's jaw. Carnera fell in a heap. The cameras ceased grinding.



image.png

- - My oh My? Or Myopic? Or perhaps Muppet?

None of that changes the fact after losses to Leroy Haynes ca 1936, Primo returned to his hometown of Sequels to marry his wife in 1939. Now Italy was far removed from the early onset of WW2, so no matter the timeline of militarization, Primo was married with Kids, and like Germans in Germany, either you flew the **** flag they gave you and saluted, or the family got hauled off to a labor camp.

Nor does any of that change the fact that Carnera joined the Italian anti-******* partisans and was wounded by the ****s near Cremona, Italy, in 1943

Nor does it change that Primo with his family became US citizens.

Or perhaps MoonBeam?

[Willie Pep 229]

During , Carnera returned to . Though a Blackshirt during the war, he was exempted from actual because of his health—Carnera had one kidney removed in 1938, his kidney disease thought to be related to his . He did, however, serve as a reluctant tool for the *******s. He also continued to fight in exhibition bouts and made a few films in Italy to earn much-needed cash.
Encyclopaedia Brittanica.


In 1941, Carnera was hand-picked by Mussolini to take part in a propaganda film in North Africa. In order "to prove the inferiority of Negro race" a boxing match was set up between Carnera and a 6 foot 3 inch Zulu POW by the name of Kay Masaki.


This chapter analyses the propagandistic construction of the boxer Primo Carnera as a ******* hero during the 1930s. It draws on studies of propagandistic nation building and on the centrality of sport and sports films to political communication, especially in the cases of dictatorships. Applying social semiotic multimodality, the study textually and visually investigates documentaries and newsreels about Carnera found in the archive of Istituto Luce, the Italian film institute that under fascism spread Mussolini’s propaganda. The results show that any event of Carnera’s life served the ******* purpose, from fighting in London to training in the USA, from being surrounded by an adoring crowd in Italy to attending kids’ boxing matches in Miami. Textually, the grandiloquent language of the regime extolled Carnera’s international fame and devotion to ******* values; visually, the propaganda highlighted Carnera’s strength and Italianness. Importantly, when Carnera spoke directly to the camera, he replicated Mussolini’s verbal and non-verbal language. These items were shot before the racial laws, when the regime still hoped to enter the international forum of Western democracies. The internationally renowned boxer was thus meant as a sort of passport for fascism, able to improve the uneven relationships of the dictatorship with other nations.

Primo ("Old Satchelfoot") Carnera has been reported wounded in action. He has been reported shot for treason by the *******s. But last week the former world's heavyweight champion was reported gloriously alive, the victim of the most ignominious defeat in his ponderous career.

Allied troops who escaped from Italian prison camps told how Carnera had been selected as the hero of a ******* propaganda movie illustrating the physical superiority of Italians over African Negroes. For this purpose, the propagandists chose an impressive opponent for Carnera: a burly, six-foot-three Zulu prisoner from the Army of South Africa, Kay Masaki. He had never boxed before. He was fed nothing for three days, then placed in the ring with Carnera. The cameras started grinding.

With one blow, Camera sent Masaki crashing to the floor. The big Negro stayed there a while. Then he struggled to his feet, dazedly shook his head and, advancing on Carnera, delivered a fearful haymaker under the Italian's jaw. Carnera fell in a heap. The cameras ceased grinding.



image.png

RE The Encyclopedia Brittanica.

Interesting take on the subject. Likely factual but does it dig deep enough to know the man's character? (See Queen's argument above.)

On the lighter side of things . . . The Encyclopedia Brittanica . . . Isn't that a Socttish history of the World? I am not sure I see British history as the touchstone for historical truth.

We are speaking of a group that told the World Napoleon died of syphilis or failed to address the true nature of two mercantile wars that forced opium into the Chinese culture, yet somehow still think themselves as the defintion of civilized.

Our current (American) boy wonder Ron (meatball) DeSantis would be very happy with EB, all the Critical Race Theory never made into the narative.

Anyway, when a Brit talks about the French, Germans, or Italians I always take it with a grain of salt. Even if the source is claimed by its creators to be definitive.

[Willie Pep 229]

During , Carnera returned to . Though a Blackshirt during the war, he was exempted from actual because of his health—Carnera had one kidney removed in 1938, his kidney disease thought to be related to his . He did, however, serve as a reluctant tool for the *******s. He also continued to fight in exhibition bouts and made a few films in Italy to earn much-needed cash.
Encyclopaedia Brittanica.


In 1941, Carnera was hand-picked by Mussolini to take part in a propaganda film in North Africa. In order "to prove the inferiority of Negro race" a boxing match was set up between Carnera and a 6 foot 3 inch Zulu POW by the name of Kay Masaki.


This chapter analyses the propagandistic construction of the boxer Primo Carnera as a ******* hero during the 1930s. It draws on studies of propagandistic nation building and on the centrality of sport and sports films to political communication, especially in the cases of dictatorships. Applying social semiotic multimodality, the study textually and visually investigates documentaries and newsreels about Carnera found in the archive of Istituto Luce, the Italian film institute that under fascism spread Mussolini’s propaganda. The results show that any event of Carnera’s life served the ******* purpose, from fighting in London to training in the USA, from being surrounded by an adoring crowd in Italy to attending kids’ boxing matches in Miami. Textually, the grandiloquent language of the regime extolled Carnera’s international fame and devotion to ******* values; visually, the propaganda highlighted Carnera’s strength and Italianness. Importantly, when Carnera spoke directly to the camera, he replicated Mussolini’s verbal and non-verbal language. These items were shot before the racial laws, when the regime still hoped to enter the international forum of Western democracies. The internationally renowned boxer was thus meant as a sort of passport for fascism, able to improve the uneven relationships of the dictatorship with other nations.

Primo ("Old Satchelfoot") Carnera has been reported wounded in action. He has been reported shot for treason by the *******s. But last week the former world's heavyweight champion was reported gloriously alive, the victim of the most ignominious defeat in his ponderous career.

Allied troops who escaped from Italian prison camps told how Carnera had been selected as the hero of a ******* propaganda movie illustrating the physical superiority of Italians over African Negroes. For this purpose, the propagandists chose an impressive opponent for Carnera: a burly, six-foot-three Zulu prisoner from the Army of South Africa, Kay Masaki. He had never boxed before. He was fed nothing for three days, then placed in the ring with Carnera. The cameras started grinding.

With one blow, Camera sent Masaki crashing to the floor. The big Negro stayed there a while. Then he struggled to his feet, dazedly shook his head and, advancing on Carnera, delivered a fearful haymaker under the Italian's jaw. Carnera fell in a heap. The cameras ceased grinding.



image.png

P.S. Any idea who the the other guys in the picture are? They don't look into it, even the ones in uniform don't seem to be much in to it. Just one guy in a suit, who at best is merely offering an unenthusiastic wave.

Primo seems to be the only one into doing it.

The one actual black shirt in uniform looks camera shy. lol (Although he just might be a local cop.)

Now had that been a bunch of Germans you bet they would all be at attention with arm extended.

The Italians switched sides in that war as fast and as often as a gambler tries to hedge his bet upon hearing new informatin, immediately.

Mussolini got to spend 20 years trying to herd cats. (The Italian Populace.) That was his real punishment.

[JAB5239]

Like I said YOU are opting out of it, and obvisouly I gave you something to do. Your logic is flawed and you won't even compare past heavies to modern ones like I'm asking for it. You do not know how to rate a resume. List the 20 heavyweights who had better resumes ( presumably you have Vitali at 21so while you are at it list up to 30 ) .I want to pick apart your list with data, independent raking information and expose your lack of common sense With ring records, cross existing raked fighters of different eras, and factoring in film. We'll see how has " flawed reasoning ." Are you game or chicken little?

This is a history forum. Louis gave just 2 back men title shots of his 26 defenses. One, who was a light heavyweight who couldn't see, the other looked better on the surviving film, and knocked him down twice but was robbed by 21 of 30 men at ringside. Yes, anyone with a brain knows American white guys and Western Europeans ) have not produced much since the Eastern Europeans entered the game. Fury is the exception going back 50 years! That is a different conversation as to why.

But getting back to the rankings. List your top 30.

I don't know how to rate a resume? Lmao.....maybe not. But I'm a far cry better at than you who wants Louis to lose points for not fighting any eastern europeans and only 2 black defenses even he fought more highly rated contenders. That logic alone is enough for me to stop wasting my time with you. Every time I show you something or explain something to you, you push the goal posts back. It's become a never ending cycle with you.

[Ivich]

RE The Encyclopedia Brittanica.

Interesting take on the subject. Likely factual but does it dig deep enough to know the man's character? (See Queen's argument above.)

On the lighter side of things . . . The Encyclopedia Brittanica . . . Isn't that a Socttish history of the World? I am not sure I see British history as the touchstone for historical truth.

We are speaking of a group that told the World Napoleon died of syphilis or failed to address the true nature of two mercantile wars that forced opium into the Chinese culture, yet somehow still think themselves as the defintion of civilized.

Our current (American) boy wonder Ron (meatball) DeSantis would be very happy with EB, all the Critical Race Theory never made into the narative.

Anyway, when a Brit talks about the French, Germans, or Italians I always take it with a grain of salt. Even if the source is claimed by its creators to be definitive.

Bottom line Carnera was a propaganda tool for Mussolini and the ******* movement and he never fought in any capacity in WW2.

As to Primo's character? From interviews with him ,my opinion is he was a decent and courageous man who was criminally exploited by a group of blood sucking scum .

[Ivich]

- - My oh My? Or Myopic? Or perhaps Muppet?

None of that changes the fact after losses to Leroy Haynes ca 1936, Primo returned to his hometown of Sequels to marry his wife in 1939. Now Italy was far removed from the early onset of WW2, so no matter the timeline of militarization, Primo was married with Kids, and like Germans in Germany, either you flew the **** flag they gave you and saluted, or the family got hauled off to a labor camp.

Nor does any of that change the fact that Carnera joined the Italian anti-******* partisans and was wounded by the ****s near Cremona, Italy, in 1943

Nor does it change that Primo with his family became US citizens.

Or perhaps MoonBeam?

The Cremona story is a bunch of horse **** long ago discredited and blown apart, Carnera was never wounded nor did he ever take up arms in any capacity in WW2.
Keep trying Queenie,who knows one day you might get something right! But not this day!lol
The Carnera's were granted dual citizenship,they never renounced their Italian nationality.
ps It's Sequals ,not Sequels.

[QueensburyRules]

[QUOTE=Ivich;n31771382]

The Cremona story is a bunch of horse **** long ago discredited and blown apart, Carnera was never wounded nor did he ever take up arms in any capacity in WW2.
Keep trying Queenie,who knows one day you might get something right! But not this day!lol
The Carnera's were granted dual citizenship,they never renounced their Italian nationality.
[/QUOTE]

- - Take it up with Boxrec, and good luck with that.

Never mentioned Primo's Italian citizenship, YOU just did!

[Willie Pep 229]

[QUOTE=QueensburyRules;n31771439]

The Cremona story is a bunch of horse **** long ago discredited and blown apart, Carnera was never wounded nor did he ever take up arms in any capacity in WW2.
Keep trying Queenie,who knows one day you might get something right! But not this day!lol
The Carnera's were granted dual citizenship,they never renounced their Italian nationality.
[/QUOTE]

- - Take it up with Boxrec, and good luck with that.

Never mentioned Primo's Italian citizenship, YOU just did!

Boxrec refers to the partisan/wounded/Cremona, Italy, story as a "factoid."

But it also refers to the removal of his kidney and his appearances in several Hollywood films as factoids as well, (when we know those things are facts?)

So in Boxrec's mind, what hell is a 'factoid'?

P.S. The fact that he received dual citizenship in 1953 at the height of the McCarthy Red Scare and Xenophobia, suggests to me that the United States didn't see much wrong in his Mussolini/*******/Black Shirt adventures.

I think those above who labeled him a stooge got it right.

[Ivich]

[QUOTE=Willie Pep 229;n31771557]

Boxrec refers to the partisan/wounded/Cremona, Italy, story as a "factoid."

But it also refers to the removal of his kidney and his appearances in several Hollywood films as factoids as well, (when we know those things are facts?)

So in Boxrec's mind, what hell is a 'factoid'?

P.S. The fact that he received dual citizenship in 1953 at the height of the McCarthy Red Scare and Xenophobia, suggests to me that the United States didn't see much wrong in his Mussolini/*******/Black Shirt adventures.

I think those above who labeled him a stooge got it right.

Anytime anyone produces an article from a reliable and primary source that Carnera ever fought with the partisans , I'll believe it until then NOPE!
Carnera was used and abused I think it would be very unkind to blame him for allowing himself to be dressed in blackshirt uniform and be seen giving the ******* salute,the majority of Italians were certainly in favour of Mussolini early on as were the Germans with Hitler.
The fact that he was nominally a ******* would be in his favour as far as that POS McCarthy was concerned,I would imagine.
Factoid = Unverified and in many cases highly unlikely. My generous definition.

The real definition.

Factoid

False claim that is repeated so often that it becomes accepted as fact or common knowledge

A factoid is either an invented or assumed statement presented as a fact, or a true but brief or trivial item of news or information. The term was coined in 1973 by American writer Norman Mailer to mean a piece of information that becomes accepted as a fact even though it is not actually true, or an invented fact believed to be true because it appears in print.

[Ivich]

[QUOTE=QueensburyRules;n31771439]

The Cremona story is a bunch of horse **** long ago discredited and blown apart, Carnera was never wounded nor did he ever take up arms in any capacity in WW2.
Keep trying Queenie,who knows one day you might get something right! But not this day!lol
The Carnera's were granted dual citizenship,they never renounced their Italian nationality.
[/QUOTE]

- - Take it up with Boxrec, and good luck with that.

Never mentioned Primo's Italian citizenship, YOU just did!

What needs to happen here is, YOU have made a statement,and have been called on it by ME.
The onus is now on YOU to produce proof of YOUR statement.
That is how it works.