The greatness that was Jimmy Young

[billeau2]

if i remember correctly young didn't win one round although ali landed zero punches in it. that alone speaks volumes about judging against ali at the time. if he was more pushed (more popular, moneymaker) he would have a better resume than frazier and frazier is considered an atg.

Im glad you mentioned that.

[PRINCEKOOL]

Speed and technical ability was impressive, he did remind me of Larry Holmes 'In the stance he used, and how he threw his punches'.

Slightly more neater with his punches.

If Young stood up to Cooney's power and Foreman's, head to head historically with his speed and skills? He has to be a danger for anyone.

[billeau2]

Speed and technical ability was impressive, he did remind me of Larry Holmes 'In the stance he used, and how he threw his punches'.

Slightly more neater with his punches.

If Young stood up to Cooney's power and Foreman's, head to head historically with his speed and skills? He has to be a danger for anyone.

Sometimes I feel like Young was born in the wrong state. Michael Moore had an upstanding tradition of being a top dog in the kronk gym, even though he was not considered along the lines of some of the first rate fighters that came out of that area. In Michigan boxing ethos, cageyness, technical excellence, is rewarded more than hard nosed, balls to the wall, type fighting. Young would have been venerated in Michigan instead of being looked at as a runt in Philly where a different ethos of fighting was practiced.

[them_apples]

I will make a case for putting Jimmy Young down as a great fighter, right up there with Foreman, Norton, Ali, Frazier... and will try to address some of the critics about Young. At his best, witness the Foreman fight, he is like a heavy weight Charly Burley, both men never having been champions of the division... Both men never waste a punch, with the caveat that Jimmy was more of a combo puncher than Burley... Both men were defensively gifted, always in a position to counter, and would punish the opponent for any miss. While Burley was expressionless, an efficiency machine, Jimmy was a character, with a sly s hit eating grin, a smirk, but that same technical greatness.



First, Young is often characterized as "inconsistent." If we look carefully and consider the following we can address this critiscism: first, lets bookend his career, like most fighters he came up learned a few lessons, and fought past hi better days:

this is what we get, coming up he lost a few with his first big loss against Shavers who he would later draw with. On the other end of things, he lost a few to ossie Ocasio, where he was allegedly out of shape, and really? this was the end of his career as a legit condender.

Looking at his middle between those bookends, we have to throw the judges out the window... Young could easily have been declared the victor over Ali and Norton. It would seem that Young was not inconsistent at all. He may have came up in learning mode, losing to a few no name opponents, and he was obviously past it after the Norton fight. If we give him the benefit of the doubt on one of the decisions that were contraversal, the guy basically lost to one guy (either Norton, or Ali) and its not a stretch to say he beat Ali and Norton.

This would mean that Young essentially beat: Lyle (twice) drew with Shavers after a loss, Norton, Ali, and Foreman!

If you watch Young he is a fantastic fighter. Again, he had a first rate chin, great speed, technical excellence on the level of a guy like Moore, or Burley, and a big heart.

I think Young's speed might have been enough to beat Frazier as well.

Thoughts? And let me just say in advance: Queenie you are a halfwit.

on his best night young was a great fighter, he had ATG characteristics. I'm not sure why he didn't go further, haven't read enough on him, if their are any books on him let me know.

[The Old LefHook]

Jimmy was one of the top 10 pure boxers of all time.

[billeau2]

on his best night young was a great fighter, he had ATG characteristics. I'm not sure why he didn't go further, haven't read enough on him, if their are any books on him let me know.

I mean... thats kind of the thing lol. the guy really was overlooked. I think it is only fair to make a few concessions to Young:

1) The judges decisions... They should be looked at as proving nothing more than Young fought competatively against some of the best competition ever, in the heavyweight division. So, a loss, or win to Norton could have gone either way. Ditto for Ali.

2) Young was consistent at his best, during the times when he fought the best in the division. His loss to Shavers, which was partially avenged with a draw, was his first major fight... during which time he did lose to some lessor names.

And after Norton, he was no longer at his best, showing up out of shape and losing to lesser names. Yet during his main career, he only lost via decision, and could have virtually been undefeated against the likes of Foreman, Lyle, etc.

[them_apples]

I mean... thats kind of the thing lol. the guy really was overlooked. I think it is only fair to make a few concessions to Young:

1) The judges decisions... They should be looked at as proving nothing more than Young fought competatively against some of the best competition ever, in the heavyweight division. So, a loss, or win to Norton could have gone either way. Ditto for Ali.

2) Young was consistent at his best, during the times when he fought the best in the division. His loss to Shavers, which was partially avenged with a draw, was his first major fight... during which time he did lose to some lessor names.

And after Norton, he was no longer at his best, showing up out of shape and losing to lesser names. Yet during his main career, he only lost via decision, and could have virtually been undefeated against the likes of Foreman, Lyle, etc.

I agree, ability wise young is very very good. I think he just ran into very stiff comp when he was at his best, and past his best as well. He just never had it easy.

If you look at Holmes, he has a much easier road to the spotlight than Young (even though he claims the opposite). Holmes got rid of a washed up Parkinson's ridden Ali, had a life and death fight with Norton who was certainly past his best and blown up, then proceeded to get a string of victories against oponents nobody would have expected to beat him. Even the Cooney fight, the highlight of his career - was really just a showcase of a great fighter getting in with a good fighter. I don't think anyone was truly surprised when Holmes beat him.

Not to get side tracked though about Holmes, but I brought him up as an example that what if Young had Holmes career. I'm sure his confidence would have grown as well has his bank account, allowing him to better prepare himself for fights.

He struck me as a great fighter who just never got the shot to showcase how good he was. Getting in with extremely experienced fighters that overshadowed him (while Green), and then after being worn out, getting in with another crop of good fighters later on, while being past his best.

[billeau2]

I agree, ability wise young is very very good. I think he just ran into very stiff comp when he was at his best, and past his best as well. He just never had it easy.

If you look at Holmes, he has a much easier road to the spotlight than Young (even though he claims the opposite). Holmes got rid of a washed up Parkinson's ridden Ali, had a life and death fight with Norton who was certainly past his best and blown up, then proceeded to get a string of victories against oponents nobody would have expected to beat him. Even the Cooney fight, the highlight of his career - was really just a showcase of a great fighter getting in with a good fighter. I don't think anyone was truly surprised when Holmes beat him.

Not to get side tracked though about Holmes, but I brought him up as an example that what if Young had Holmes career. I'm sure his confidence would have grown as well has his bank account, allowing him to better prepare himself for fights.

He struck me as a great fighter who just never got the shot to showcase how good he was. Getting in with extremely experienced fighters that overshadowed him (while Green), and then after being worn out, getting in with another crop of good fighters later on, while being past his best.

Yup ran smack dab into the guys who would showcase the eighties, when he was past it.

[The Old LefHook]

The Mighty Joe Young was more well known for his power.

[Dr. Z]

I think Young is a little mis-understood. He wasn't that fast, but he had an excellent defense for sure. A mis-managed fighter.